08 July 2005

Clean Up Thine Own Back Yard.

Thomas Friedman in the Old Gray Lady

Because there is no obvious target to retaliate against, and because there are not enough police to police every opening in an open society, either the Muslim world begins to really restrain, inhibit and denounce its own extremists - if it turns out that they are behind the London bombings - or the West is going to do it for them. And the West will do it in a rough, crude way - by simply shutting them out, denying them visas and making every Muslim in its midst guilty until proven innocent.

And because I think that would be a disaster, it is essential that the Muslim world wake up to the fact that it has a jihadist death cult in its midst. If it does not fight that death cult, that cancer, within its own body politic, it is going to infect Muslim-Western relations everywhere. Only the Muslim world can root out that death cult. It takes a village.

Muslim society must decide, starting today, if it wants to work and play well with others. If it chooses to bomb and terrorize the rest of the world, becaues that rest of the world is not Muslim enough for them, then, alas, there can be but one outcome.

I'm also advocating Friedman's new book, and I'm far from alone.


flamer said...

In all the time since 9/11 there have been no convictions of authentic Al-Queda members, and no true Al-Queda cells discovered here or elsewhere.

There were no Arab names present in the passenger lists or Arab DNA in the forensic investigations into the 9/11 pane crashes.

The only evidence to point to Arabs in the 7/7 bombings was a quickly discreditied website. In fact, the explosives now appear to have been military, not the homemade type popular with "Al-Queda."

I'd like some proof that Arabs are actually doing any of this.


You got anything?

OctaneBoy said...

I don't know what you'll accept for "authentic" Al-Queda membership, but Richard Reid, a Muslim Arab who claimed to be Al-Queda, was convicted and is serving life for trying to blow up a civillian airliner.

I'm not sure what Arab has to do with anything. It's old-school Muslim intolerance that has the problem with the West. I also don't know why 9/11 passenger lists are relevant; the 19 terrorists who took over and crashed the 4 planes were all Muslim Arabs.

It's my understanding that the London bombs are very much the signatue of Al-Queda; high-power explosives (pilfered military weaponry) and very simple detonation mechanisms.

flamer said...

My apologies for not being clear.
Of the 400 suspects detained under federal terrorism investigations, only 39 convictions resulted. Very few (if any) of those had any clear links to Al Queda. (Even Reid's involvement is in question.)
My point; Where is this massive terrorist network that Tel Aviv and others warned us about in the months before the attacks? We've only found 4 or 5 individuals? In 4 years? It's not for lack of trying, I'm sure.

Why 9/11?
The connection is simple. These two terrorist events are being blamed on Al Queda, i.e. Arab Muslim Extremists, despite any evidence to back the claim.

For example, your own statement "the 19 terrorists who took over and crashed the 4 planes were all Muslim Arabs" is non-proveable.
Seven of those 19 are still alive, victims of identity theft and having nothing to do with the hijackings. Knowing this, the identities of the remaining 12 naturally become suspect. The lack of Arab names and DNA on those planes then becomes highly significant.

The leap then is, if we don't know if "Al Queda" was really behind 9/11, how can we be sure they were behind 7/7? The same "lack of evidence" exists, yet the name "Al Queda" is all over the news today.

OctaneBoy said...

I don't know anything about what Tel Aviv has warned. I'm always amazed how Israel seems so untouched by external threats these days.

In the long run, it doesn't matter who's in Al Queda. It's just a club. If the brainwashed who fly planes into buildings were born in Riyadh or Cairo or Denver, it doesn't matter. If train bombers or car bombers are from Iran or Scotland or Peru, it doesn't matter. What matters is that they are willing to inflict this kind of random murder and therefore must be stopped.

I'm not sure why you seem to want to disconnect Muslim Arabs from 9/11, and everything before and after. If the accusation is wrong, why are they being scapegoated? Who's actually blowing things up? I'm all ears - can you link a source or some background?

To say that there is no evidence to back the claim that Muslim extremists are behind Madrid, Istanbul, Jakarta, Riyadh, Morocco, Yemen, Bali, WTC'93, USS Cole, 9/11, Dar es Salaam, Nairobi, etc., is like saying that no Capricorn has ever been convited of DWI.

Also, who has the technical acumen to absolutely rule out any 'Arab DNA' from 4 plane crash sites? That claim is too incredible to believe.

I'd also gladly read any info that disputes the FBI's identification of the 19 hijackers. Don't tease out the doubt, tell me who was behind all this.

I agree that the public does not yet know who was behind 7/7. London is very wired and "camera-ed." Perhaps all that footage will lead someplace. If it turns out the trains were bombed by left-handed Austrian/Irish video editors, I'll call for their stomping with the same voice I use for those who follow Al Queda's mission.

Al Queda is all over the news because its understood figurehead has called for the destruction of those who are not Muslim enough for him.

flamer said...

I do not know who did it. But i am intrigued by the tendency to blame al Queda for everything these days. Especially when the outcome doesn't benefit al Queda.
They want the infidels out, yet all their attacks have done is brought in more troops. There's a phrase: "Kill the people and they send more soldiers, kill the soldiers and they go home."
So who benefits? Well, let's see... the Neocon agenda was instantly realized after 9/11; anyone preferring that the West's military might was focused on Arabs would be pleased; and of course anyone who wanted that military might to stay in the gulf would be tickled that Tony Blair has now reversed his decision to begin a troop pullout.
I don't know if I'm right, I just know I don't believe everything I'm told.
I will post links to some of my claims when I have the chance.

flamer said...

Re: London Bombings

Re: Arabs on Flights

Re: Hijackers Alive: